2012 - Push Start - Just cycles Acc, On, Off

[goodbyeCapo]

My sister had her 2012 2.4l towed to my house after sitting up about a few months. After getting juice flowing again, when I press the brake then the push button, it just cycles through Acc, On, and Off. Almost like I'm not pressing the brake at all. It doesn't attempt to start. I've tried what knew off hand, scanned all the posts here, and looked at youtube. So maybe you all have an idea.

 

What I've tried/tested:

 

• I replaced the battery in both the car and the keyfob. The locks and everything respond to the key fob.
• I checked the fuses and relays
• I jumped the starter relay, starter did turn.
• Checked the brake position switch, verified it turns on the lights and engages the transmission lock. I guess it's still possible its not sending a signal to the ignition?
• No codes are being thrown via obd currently.

 

Additionally:

• I've read maybe there is a security feature keeping the car from starting?
• My sister mentioned the alternator might be bad, but I don't see why this would prevent the car from at least trying to start, but I've been wrong before. When the car was delivered I pulled a p0562 so that makes sense.

 

[John/Horace]

Put some jumpers on the battery and try and start it again. Or run a charger for a few hours and make sure you have voltage in the 12.2-12.9 range. 

[5rebel9]

The battery is a PAIN to get to, but I agree with John. Also clean the terminals and jumper post connections. 

Do you get the "key not detected" message on the dash?

[goodbyeCapo]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Battery:

• I did install a new battery... which yes I agree.. what a pita location.
• I just pulled the voltage via the service terminals up top by the fuse box. 12.8v

Keyfob:

• Not currently getting that, was initially which is what lead to changing the battery out. 
• I can cause this condition by holding down the unlock button on the fob and pressing the ignition button + brake. Which likely isn't anything other than the limitation of the fob itself.

 

Perhaps something with the immobilizer? I can't find much information in regard to this feature. The first thing I did.. accidentally was hit the panic button

 

[5rebel9]

Try locking the car with interior drivers door  switch and close the door. then use the "key"(hidden inside the fob) to manually unlock the drivers door. IF you can roll the drivers window down first, it may be helpful. then see what it does. I know on the Avengers(very similar platform car) that they say this deactivates the anti theft if it was armed.

[goodbyeCapo]

No go on that, found some information on the anti-theft system. Seems that's probably not it. Thanks for the suggestion though.

[2late4u]

have you tried putting the gear shift in neutral to see if it helps?

[goodbyeCapo]

Yeah, unfortunately push to start requires the vehicle to be in park. When trying with the vehicle in neutral I just get a message on the screen telling me the vehicle is not in park.

[2late4u]

59 minutes ago, goodbyeCapo said:

Yeah, unfortunately push to start requires the vehicle to be in park. When trying with the vehicle in neutral I just get a message on the screen telling me the vehicle is not in park.

at least you know the neutral safety switch isn't the problem

[2late4u]

5 hours ago, Locosiete said:

 

Thats odd mine i can start while in natural, luckily not while in gear.

Just went and checked mine as well yep it will start in neutral as well,,,,THE plot thickens.....i know the older ones were a mechanical switch or linkage and i would assume the newer ones are electrical, might be a problem there......also the battery cable has a battery temperature sensor built into one of the cables that when it goes bad it wont let the car start.good luck

[John/Horace]

Passenger fuse panel F121 fuse controls the push button start, 15 amp I think. Remove and test it for continuity.

 

Jumping starter relay bypassed park/neutral, key fob security. Need a detailed schematic for trouble shooting. If you can cycle ignition to run position, then jump starter relay and car runs. It might need reprogramming remotes; sitting dead shouldn’t trigger that. Odd. 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2021 by John/Horace

[goodbyeCapo]

Rained all day today so didn't get much done. One question to owners with push buttons: when your vehicle is off, does your steering wheel lock? Or can you turn it freely? 

 

Catching up on replies:

1. I tried that pushing the button 5 times thing way more times than I'd admit to before posting. 

2. Brake switch works as far as the lights and transmission goes. Doesn't mean the signal is making its way to the ignition though. May pull it tomorrow and check the wiring. 

[goodbyeCapo]

Thanks everyone for the replies and suggestions, I have finally resolved the issue. So to not be one of those idiots who never come back to update a thread with their solution -

 

SOLVED: The fuse box connection itself to the Starter Solenoid was loose and had corrosion underneath.

• I pulled the whole fuse box under the hood, given it's location and odd battery placement I wanted to check the connections to the box themselves
• I noticed the connection feeding to the Starter Solenoid slot k135 was a a bit dirty so I cleaned it up
  • The clip was also loose but this may have happen as I was removing the box itself, either way verify it's snugly seated.
• Notes on missing this on my initial diagnosis:
  • The solenoid on it's own tested good and I'd swapped it with another just to be sure.
  • When I jumped the starter via a jump wire the starter worked fine even with the corrosion/loose connection.
    • This is likely due to the extra pressure I applied inserting the slightly larger gauge wire in the slot.
  • The vehicle didn't throw any codes. Which I imagine is the same behavior it would if the solenoid was failed.

[5rebel9]

So you are referring to one of the modular connectors under the fuse panel/TIPM? or the B+ jumper post/TIPM power supply?

[goodbyeCapo]

Well, just when I think I'm out they pull me back in... Seems there are electrical gremlins all over the place in this thing. So went back out to crank it up... back to not starting... However, since I had it running earlier I was able to now pull some codes. One in particular a u110 p code, which is some sort of communication error. I'll do some digging once I get out of the office today.

 

I did locate the wires called out in this video related to the can bus.. But i havent had a change to investigate any further..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgOZjgOm420

 

 

 

Modular connectors on that one.

 

 

[5rebel9]

The car is still "acting up" or codes were checked after having the TIPM unplugged? You could have set loss of comm type codes when you removed the TIPM for inspection(depending on how power was disconnected first).

  I would suggest clearing codes and then seeing what comes back.

[goodbyeCapo]

5 hours ago, 5rebel9 said:

The car is still "acting up" or codes were checked after having the TIPM unplugged?

Car is back to original not starting condition, so I can't pull new codes. Got a busy few days coming up, will be back at it in a few days.

[Djromeo]

I did all this BS and finally the “push start button 5 times wait for gages to settle hit the break and start button one more time finally worked just make sure you have enough battery power or it won’t start. So yes my battery is bad but when it dies it threw it into a security feature mode and that pushing the start button 5X works. Thanks guys. 

[Djromeo]

My battery being so low in voltage caused the truck to go into some kinda of security mode. So follow the instructions Yes push the push start button 5X wait for gauges to settle step on break and hit the start button one more time. (Make sure that your battery is charged or hooked up with jumper cables) the low battery voltage cause the journey to go into a “security mode” according to dodge. Honestly just buy a battery ASAP but if your like me paycheck to paycheck your gonna run into this problem.