eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 any idea why I would get both codes at the same time. engine runs rough, seems like it has a misfire, but no misfire code comes up. I've cleared the 2097 and 2099 and they come back. supposed to be rich fuel at post cat sensor. everything looks fine at sensors, both pre and post cats. when watching o2 sensor performance on my scan tool, the post sit about .75 volts with very little variation. pre cat sensors jump around, but randomly. i've read they should jump .1 to .9, but mine jump all over between .1 and .9 randomly. I was thinking plugged cat. converters, exhaust flow seems fine. seems strange that 2 or 4 o2 sensors would go bad at the same time. it seems it would be some other problem. Any help is appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5rebel9 Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 Couple of questions... after this. Welcome to the forum! Now what size motor and miles? What has been done for maint, spark plugs, air filter? How long has the CEL been on before deciding to try and track down the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 Thanks for the welcome. it is the 3.6 L vvt it has 114000 miles on it. it has original spark plugs, air filter changed around every 30 k miles. oil changed about 3k miles. the light just came on. it's been driven about 20 miles since the light came on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5rebel9 Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 Well you're ride is about 15k miles overdue for fresh spark plugs and if they are too worn, you'll get fuel ratio related codes. I'd start there as I doubt the converters or O2 sensors are the problem. Keep in touch on how things go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 really ?? you think spark plugs with 100k miles could trigger those two codes? I'll give it a try, but I find it suspicious that both post cat o2 sensors would put out the same code, at the same time. That would require one or more plugs on each bank of the engine malfunctioning at the same time. Am I thinking correctly? The car has been running like a champ since new. Then, it starts acting up and the cel comes on with these two codes. I was thinking it would have to be something that would affect both banks of cylinders. Like an intake problem or fuel delivery problem, before the injectors. But I could be overthinking it? Thanks for you input. I'll run pick up some plugs and replace them yet tonight and let you know if that does it. If you think of anything else, please let me know. Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5rebel9 Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 IF I did not think so I would not have posted it to you or anyone else. What type driving(engine run time, speeds, distances) do you mainly do with the vehicle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 generally short trips with the occasional trip of 100 miles. No need to get short with me, I'm just asking questions, that what a forum is all about, helping each other out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2late4u Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 What are the causes of the P2099 code? Some potential causes of this trouble code may include: The mass air flow sensor could be malfunctioning The mass air flow sensor’s circuitry could be damaged The air inlet tubing connected to the intake manifold could have a vacuum leak allowing unmetered air to enter the engine The oxygen sensor(s) or circuitry could be damaged Anything that could cause a rich condition, such as a faulty fuel pressure regulator or manifold absolute pressure sensor The powertrain control module could be malfunctioning Replace/Repair These Parts To Fix OBD Code P2097 Fuel Pressure Regulator – A fuel pressure regulator is a device used to control the pressure of fuel supplied to the fuel injectors on an engine, even during dramatic changes in fuel demand. Controlling this pressure is needed so that the fuel injectors can receive and dispense fuel at a known rate. So, it is important to replace faulty regulator now! Mass Air Flow Sensor - A faulty mass airflow sensor will cause problems similar to low compression or low vacuum, and will also show symptoms similar to when your vehicle has low fuel pressure from a faulty fuel pump. Thus, replace damaged/faulty MAF sensor today! Electronic Control Unit – ECU monitors the temperature differences in the boost converter with the help of the temperature sensors to prevent the converter from overheating and malfunctioning. Thus, replace faulty ECU immediately. Oxygen Sensor – The O2 sensor can also be at fault leading to lean or rich engine conditions and thus affecting the engine performance and improper fuel consumption. Buy new sensor and replace the faulty one now! Engine Control Module - ECM failures and faults can be very difficult to find and resolve as these are very rare and might require a complete reprogramming of the system to avoid wrong codes from getting stored in the system, leading to misdiagnosis. Replace it now! Exhaust System Parts – Are you seeing this error code flashing? Well, it could be due to malfunctioning exhaust system parts. In addition to this error code, the driver is likely to experience a noisy engine, decrease in power and acceleration. We strongly recommend you to purchase new exhaust system parts from Parts Avatar. Powertrain Control Module - Faulty PCM can disrupt the normal functioning of the vehicle by affecting the transmission system and the fuel delivery system. This will cause the system to store wrong OBD error and thus can lead to misdiagnosis. Diagnostic Tool - In order to be that DIY guy, you need few diagnostic tools to get your car problems pointed out easily. Our diagnostic tools collection will come in handy to do so, so why not have a look? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5rebel9 Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 (edited) Was not trying to be short with you. Having to ask 20 questions to find out what could be going on is not how to get good help. Miles on the plugs is a proper starting point as you say it still seems to "run like a champ". Unless all of a sudden engine performance has also dropped drastically (like in 2late4u's post above). Edited July 19, 2021 by 5rebel9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 I disagree, asking questions is, by far, the best way to get good help. Understanding what is going on with the vehicle is the only way to solve problems. Thanks again for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 2late4u Thanks for the info. Where would you start? I've checked the o2 circuitry and everything looks fine. I'm searching for the mass air flow sensor, it must be hiding near the throttle body. any info on the maf would help. I'll search out the manifold pressure sensor and fuel pressure regulator. Thanks so much for the info. I've got some searching to do. If you have any other tips or ideas, please let me know. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 2late4u It appears that the journey 3.6 L doesn't have a MAF sensor?? i've searched my intake and don't recognize anything that looks like it. I also searched with google and can't find any info on it. Parts stores don't show them as a replacement part and I checked carid.com and their schematic doesn't show one. Is that correct, no maf on this car? Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John/Horace Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 Yeah no maf only MAP sensor, easy 5 minute change. Free advice worth everything you pay for it. ? https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/dodge,2012,journey,3.6l+v6,3015568,exhaust+&+emission,manifold+pressure+(map)+sensor,11207 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John/Horace Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 (edited) Comes out with first a 90 degree index twist motion, then a slight pull. I don't incourage throwing parts at cars, but this can be a wear item on 3.6. Plugs are are due as well. Edited July 19, 2021 by John/Horace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eseebeck Posted July 20, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 20, 2021 Thanks so much for all the info. I believe I had bad gas. I added a can of seafoam, drove about 30 miles around the neighborhood and things are much better. Just for fun, I sprung for new plugs, new plug boots and a new air filter. Just got home from a 200 mile road trip ( daughter's sport camp) and it is back to running like a champ. thanks again for all the info !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5rebel9 Posted July 20, 2021 Report Share Posted July 20, 2021 Good to hear that all is back to normal! YUP, one commonly overlooked possible cause is BAD GAS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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