My 2013 Journey is possessed!

[Brother_Dave]

Two days ago I attempted to jump start a friend’s truck with my 2013 Journey (I don’t know if this is related to my problem, or if it’s a coincidence). When I got in the vehicle yesterday morning it would not even attempt to start. By that I mean that the ignition lights wouldn’t move past “off”. When I would try and leave the vehicle, as soon as I shut the door the radio and air conditioning would turn on and the windshield wipers would start going as well. After a few attempts everything went back to “normal” and the vehicle would start and drive, but the “check engine” light was on. 
I took it to O’reilys and had them pull the codes. The only code that came up was “U0140 Lost Communication With Body Control Module”. I found the 30amp fuse location under the hood and changed it. Everything seemed fine and the “check engine” light went off. I drove around a decent amount the rest of the day with no problems. 
This morning I drove a very short distance and turned the vehicle off. Less than 5 minutes later I started it and ALL the dash lights lit up, including the phrase “no bus” on the display. I turned the vehicle off and tried to start it again. The process from yesterday repeated itself. I was able to get it started and back home. The fuse looks blown again, I will be going to get a new one shortly. 

Does anyone have some insight? My fear is the body control module needs to be replaced, but that’s a lot of money and I’d hate to be wrong. Also, what are the chances trying to jumpstart my buddies truck is what caused the problem?

[5rebel9]

You say "ATTEMPTED"  to jump start a buddies car. Did you hook the cables up wrong? YES if that happened, a lot of possibilities as to just what all damage it could have done. 

[Brother_Dave]

No. The “attempted” was in reference to the fact that it didn’t start. The battery was way bad and wouldn’t take a charge. I am very careful to hook the cables up carefully after a huge mistake decades ago. 

[Brother_Dave]

Update: I changed the fuse again and the light went out, so SOMETHING is causing it to keep blowing. 

[tsteves5]

The fuse chart below is for a 2011, so it might not match your 2013, but are you referring to Fuse F145?  If so, it looks like that fuse does not feed anything else.  It seems like you have either a damaged body computer, or perhaps a damaged wiring harness (a wire shorted to ground, two wires melted together, etc..). 

 

I've actually damaged previous vehicles providing jump starts in the past and I won't do it anymore.  Modern electronics are really sensitive.  I keep battery jump start boxes in all my vehicles now.  I rarely need them for my own vehicles, but they've been used a bunch for helping out others.

 

[Brother_Dave]

Yes. It’s F145. So the fact that it keeps blowing fuses is indicative of the BCM being bad? That answer makes the most sense but I’m not happy about it. 

[tsteves5]

1 hour ago, Brother_Dave said:

Yes. It’s F145. So the fact that it keeps blowing fuses is indicative of the BCM being bad? That answer makes the most sense but I’m not happy about it. 

 

It's honestly speculation on my part.  If that fuse fed multiple devices then it could be any of the devices (or wiring/plugs to that device) that have failed as shorted and cause the fuse to blow.  Since this fuse feeds only the body computer and indicator lamp, then there's not many other options.

[tsteves5]

Just now, tsteves5 said:

 

It's honestly speculation on my part.  If that fuse fed multiple devices then it could be any of the devices (or wiring/plugs to that device) that have failed as shorted and cause the fuse to blow.  Since this fuse feeds only the body computer and indicator lamp, then there's not many other options.

 

I just had another thought.  Since the fuse does not blow right away but after the vehicle has been driven, I would personally be looking for wiring or connector issues.  Perhaps some wire has the insulation worn (or burned) through and only shorts out with vibration or movement.  Perhaps something inside the computer only fails with movement or vibration.  It also might be temperature dependent, only happens if it gets hot for example.

[2late4u]

might seem to simple but how old is YOUR battery and have it checked,since you couldn't jump his truck...i would def.get the battery checked or replaced before laying out any more money on this problems journeys act crazy with a low charged battery...good luck and hope its just the battery

[NavalLacrosse]

39 minutes ago, 2late4u said:

might seem to simple but how old is YOUR battery and have it checked,since you couldn't jump his truck...i would def.get the battery checked or replaced before laying out any more money on this problems journeys act crazy with a low charged battery...good luck and hope its just the battery

Check it out, OP. 

I'm like a broken record on this topic, but when the battery is anything less than 99% perfect, the gremlins come out. they are symptoms you describe with the wipers, radio, all lights on the cluster, gauges acting weird. Ignition not working. radio and hvac controls out-of-whack. These are common when the battery and the (less frequently) the alternator are bellow perfect operational health. 

 

an easy way to test this is: If the car runs perfectly fine while connected to the jump pack, but then starts acting weird after a few minutes without the jump pack, it might be the battery is 'just' a little too old for the car's liking.

Edited August 3, 2021 by NavalLacrosse

[Brother_Dave]

I appreciate it everyone! First thing tomorrow I’ll go have the battery tested. Question on that, can that be done accurately through the posts under the hood or does that require taking off the tire? (I’ve never owned a vehicle where the battery wasn’t easily accessible)

[2late4u]

21 minutes ago, Brother_Dave said:

I appreciate it everyone! First thing tomorrow I’ll go have the battery tested. Question on that, can that be done accurately through the posts under the hood or does that require taking off the tire? (I’ve never owned a vehicle where the battery wasn’t easily accessible)

yes ask them to do a load test, and also have them check the alternator to see if it is putting out enough voltage as well ............but if your battery is more than 3 yrs old replace it and your problems,

most likely will be gone,,,,,,,DO YOU KNOW HOW OLD IT IS?????????   also if you keep blowing a certain fuse then yes you have a problem and if you are not sure what to do except buy new parts, i would recommend taking it to a shop that does electrical work

Edited August 4, 2021 by 2late4u

[Brother_Dave]

43 minutes ago, 2late4u said:

yes ask them to do a load test, and also have them check the alternator to see if it is putting out enough voltage as well ............but if your battery is more than 3 yrs old replace it and your problems,

most likely will be gone,,,,,,,DO YOU KNOW HOW OLD IT IS?????????   also if you keep blowing a certain fuse then yes you have a problem and if you are not sure what to do except buy new parts, i would recommend taking it to a shop that does electrical work

I have no idea. I bought it used 9 months ago and it’s the battery it had in it. 

[Brother_Dave]

Update: I had the battery tested this morning (I’ve had it go through the possessed routine twice since I last posted). It was low on cold cranking amps. I bought a new one and put it in. It started right up and the check engine light went away. Maybe I wasn’t blowing fuses after all? Here’s to hoping that was the solution.

[John/Horace]

You don't maybe blow fuse. Put meter in position that it beeps for continuity. Put probes across ends of fuse and if power goes through and makes meter beep, fuse is still ok. Or use ohms setting and there should be almost no resistance.

 

Or use 12 volt clamp on light in handle style tester. Need to find good ground for this style which can be tricky. One leg of fuse has power that it feeds to other side. 

Edited August 4, 2021 by John/Horace

[NavalLacrosse]

Another happy customer. 

Thanks for giving the update. most people just get the advice, fix their cars, and ghost the forum. 

After my episode with the demons, I got a small jump pack which i keep in the car, just so I know I can get the car home (or at least down the road) if the main battery fails again. 

[2late4u]

3 hours ago, John/Horace said:

You don't maybe blow fuse. Put meter in position that it beeps for continuity. Put probes across ends of fuse and if power goes through and makes meter beep, fuse is still ok. Or use ohms setting and there should be almost no resistance.

 

Or use 12 volt clamp on light in handle style tester. Need to find good ground for this style which can be tricky. One leg of fuse has power that it feeds to other side. 

had to google 30 amp cartage fuse,,,,,,,,, to see what he was talking about it maybe blowing, i have only dealt with the blade type so far,,,how do you determine that this style has blown??? is it visible like the blade type when blown???? thanks in advance

[Brother_Dave]

Bad news. I tried to start it up this morning and it went back to the possessed routine. I’ll try to describe what the routine is like

1. Open the car door. The display on the dash (not the radio) comes on but depending on the time before I push the start button, might flicker out.

2. Push the start button and nothing happens. Inductor light nicer moves from “off”

3. Open and shut the door. Radio turns on.

4. Open door, radio shuts off.

5.  Try to push the start button, AC and wipers turn on. All dash lights turn on. “NO BUS” displays at the top of the dash display. If I push the start button they turn back off.

6. Periodically, the indicator will go to ACC or RUN but will not try to start

7. After cycling through this several times the vehicle eventually starts and will run through the course of the day. It only gives me the issue if it has sat for several hours. 

I’m really start to think my problem is in the BCM. 

[5rebel9]

Just what size infotainment screen do you have the 4 or 8" ? 

  This last spring I had a weird draw problem that turned out to be the 4' radio module(easy fix), but went thru HE(double hockey sticks) to track it out on our '11 model(same set up as your year). A LOT of stuff runs thru the CD/ radio module before going thru the BCM.

  Spend some time and watch that all dash lighting turns off and stays off(watch at least 3 minutes) when shutting down for any length of time between uses.

[Brother_Dave]

1 hour ago, 5rebel9 said:

Just what size infotainment screen do you have the 4 or 8" ? 

  This last spring I had a weird draw problem that turned out to be the 4' radio module(easy fix), but went thru HE(double hockey sticks) to track it out on our '11 model(same set up as your year). A LOT of stuff runs thru the CD/ radio module before going thru the BCM.

  Spend some time and watch that all dash lighting turns off and stays off(watch at least 3 minutes) when shutting down for any length of time between uses.

It’s the 4”. Did you end up replacing?

[5rebel9]

Yes , I did replace the CD/radio module. It was plug and play with my '11 model, not sure about the '13 nodel if it is VIN encoded. EASY remove and replace, there are a number of tou tubes about disassembly of the center dash trim to get at it.

BUT don't just throw parts at it, do some owner observation/diagnostics like I posted earlier.

   I got a used unit for free from a friend, a good used one from a parts recycler WILL be much less costly than a new unit.

  Without wiring diagrams, these things are a BEAST to track, they DEFY logical thought processes of how things work.

Edited August 5, 2021 by 5rebel9

[Brother_Dave]

Unlike the previous times, this time I CAN NOT get it to start. I have been observing everything I can. I’m just about ready to throw in the towel and call a shop. Is there any way to definitively tell if the BCM is bad? I don’t want to throw parts at it. I’m about out of $ as it is.  

[5rebel9]

To get clear clues, You really need a high level scanner that goes into the CAN electrical system that can test modules. I used one for mine, but it wasn't much help as mine showed all good with the "key" in the run position. 

BUT let's back up a little about your problem....

  Did you have the Journey running when you tried to jump start the other car? you could have blown diodes in the alternator and this will drain a battery when shut down.  It may still charge when running, but then draw from the battery while shut off.

Yes it sounds like time for a GOOD shop to DIAGNOSE and ADVISE.

[Brother_Dave]

Yes. It was running. I didn’t think one was supposed to do it otherwise. 

[NavalLacrosse]

Ahhh this is painful hearing the problem persists. 
The symptoms you describe show up often enough in complains, so I know there is a solution out there somewhere.