question before ordering HID from retrofit source

[yoj5000]

i am about to order HID light kit from retrofit source.

this is what the retrofit suggested me to get for my 2013 journey rt

• Mopar Specific: Morimoto Elite HID System
  $170.00
• — Bulbs:
  Morimoto 3Five: H13/9008 Bixenon
  +$10.00
• — Ballasts:
  Morimoto 3Five (35w)
• — Wire Harness:
  9008/H13
• — Kelvin:
  5000K

is that sounds right?

i've been looking into this for almost a week now and i would like to make the decision.

someone please help!

[davidlb512]

Holy crap! Why on earth would you pay that much for a set of H.I.D.'s? And 9008 is not the part number for either high or low beams on the Journey too. The low beams are 9006, and highs are 9005. Here's the link to the seller of sets that I've ordered multiple times for cars, and bikes. Always had great luck with them too. http://stores.ebay.com/xenonfactory?_trksid=p2047675.l2563

[yoj5000]

davidlb512/

hey, thanks for your response. it is because i do not feel like taking any risk, and i believe in "you get what you pay for"

apparently some guys from here bought it from them.

and yes you are right, it did not sound quite right they offered me to get 9008 bixenon when journey takes 9006.

that's why i put this question up here to make sure, that the retrofit source is not making mistake.

[bramfrank]

To remain street legal, why not install HIR bulbs instead of an HID conversion? Cheaper too.

If you insist on HIDs keep them at 4300K and below.

[davidlb512]

davidlb512/

hey, thanks for your response. it is because i do not feel like taking any risk, and i believe in "you get what you pay for"

apparently some guys from here bought it from them.

and yes you are right, it did not sound quite right they offered me to get 9008 bixenon when journey takes 9006.

that's why i put this question up here to make sure, that the retrofit source is not making mistake.

Xentec makes some very reliable H.I.D.'s. So what I've paid for with Xentec, has been what I've gotten. Like I said, I've had no problems with the Xentec's I've installed on 3 cars, and 2 bikes. And the set that I just ordered a few days ago for the Journey, I'm assuming I will have the same luck with. But in the end, it's not my check book that's paying for the H.I.D.'s you buy, so go with what you prefer.

Second, the 9008 has a different mounting base than the 9006 has. And a bi-xenon bulb is a high/low beam bulb. Our car has separate bulbs for the high and low beams. The bulb they are recommending to you is absolutely wrong.

Are you wanting to replace the high beams or low beams? I'm replacing the high beams only right now, as I'm not absolutely sure that the projectors in our low beams are able to properly handle H.I.D.'s.

And as far as bramfrank's concern of legality, there is nothing illegal about H.I.D. headlights. Having H.I.D.'s in your low beams, without them being in a projector housing is what is illegal in most states/cities/municipalities. And I feel that the whole point of having H.I.D.'s is to have a nice, clean, pure, white light. And 4300k color is a little too yellow to me.

[bramfrank]

Davidlb;

True enough about bulb selection - the DJ uses dedicated bulbs for low and for high beam which makes it an interesting vehicle because you can leave both on for high beam operation - you MIGHT not want to convert the highs because of the warm-up delay when switching HIDs bulbs on.

But ANY conversion to headlights is not road legal unless you recertify the assembly after the conversion because the headlights are approved under federal statutes as an assembly and anyone who tells you otherwise is wrong. Depending on where you live you could find yourself failing your annual inspection. Just because you haven't been cited doesn't make it legal. Annd if you've done a conversion and a police officer is feeling his oats, it is an easy ticket for him to write as an equipment violation.

As to the color temps, 4300K is what OEM manufacturers provide - 3000K is the color of a halogen beam, so 4300K is already trending toward 'whiter' and is definitely headed toward 'bluish' at 5000K. Note too that as HIDs age their color temperatures rise.

If you'd care to do some reading on the topic Daniel Stern is a noted expert in the field: http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

[davidlb512]

Sounds good branfrank. You use, and recommend, what you like, I'll recommend and use what I like, have used, had no issues with, and what I've established personally with multiple law enforcement officers (who happen to be known personally by me) as being perfectly legal. But your suggestion to replace the low beams, shouldn't be taken. The Journey doesn't have a projector housing for the bulbs in the low beam location. It has a reflector housing. With a halogen bulb installed, there is a nice, clean cut off to the beam of light, But that will absolutely not be the case with H.I.D. bulbs installed. That is what you are stating as being illegal. But again, I'm just speaking from knowledge and experience, so nobody should listen to me on this matter. ;-)

No more messages from me, as this is turning away from the intention of the OP.

[bramfrank]

The opinions of law enforcement officers is not the defining element as to what's legal, only what THEY know and what THEY might charge you with.

I ran into a situation a while ago where a number of law enforcement officers thought it would be perfectly legal to buy and own property that was removed from stolen vehicles as long as it couldn't be identified. They were wrong, of course and their morals obviously suspect.

That they are cops doesn't mean they're right.

If you are stopped by an officer who actually knows what the law is and if he wants to ticket you and has nothing else to write you up for (or if he is just being mean and wants to max out his revenue for the stop), rest assured you will be driving away with a ticket for an equipment violation that you will not be able to challenge.

So to correct your statement; You are speaking from experience - you have had no issues.

You may NEVER have issues. But that doesn't mean that what you are doing is legal. For example, if you are driving along 5 over the limit, because 'they always let you go 5 over' and you get pulled over, that excuse isn't going to work. 5 over is 5 over and if they want, you will be issued a ticket. It is the same with equipment violations.

The intent of the OP is to improve his lighting - If he wants to install HID lighting then he should know what the potential downside is before doing so, so he can make an informed decision.

[davidlb512]

The opinions of law enforcement officers is not the defining element as to what's legal, only what THEY know and what THEY might charge you with.

I ran into a situation a while ago where a number of law enforcement officers thought it would be perfectly legal to buy and own property that was removed from stolen vehicles as long as it couldn't be identified. They were wrong, of course and their morals obviously suspect.

That they are cops doesn't mean they're right.

If you are stopped by an officer who actually knows what the law is and if he wants to ticket you and has nothing else to write you up for (or if he is just being mean and wants to max out his revenue for the stop), rest assured you will be driving away with a ticket for an equipment violation that you will not be able to challenge.

So to correct your statement; You are speaking from experience - you have had no issues.

You may NEVER have issues. But that doesn't mean that what you are doing is legal. For example, if you are driving along 5 over the limit, because 'they always let you go 5 over' and you get pulled over, that excuse isn't going to work. 5 over is 5 over and if they want, you will be issued a ticket. It is the same with equipment violations.

The intent of the OP is to improve his lighting - If he wants to install HID lighting then he should know what the potential downside is before doing so, so he can make an informed decision.

So part of your "informing" him, is to recommend that he install H.I.D.'s into the improper reflector style housing of the low beam location? Which happens to be exactly what is illegal.

[davidlb512]

Sorry, I forgot that I said I wasn't going to post anymore on this. I'll reply to the OP only.

[bramfrank]

Stop being a troll.

I simply pointed out that there were legality issues. And be aware that your projectors are just as illegal - ANY modification is illegal. That doesn't stop people from executing them - just look in a mirror.

I also offered input as to a legal alternative (HIR bulbs) and said that if he insisted on an HID conversion what a more appropriate color temperature might be and then, after you commented, why.

[burgandy25]

Some states have it being illegal to just drop in HID bulbs, best check first, here in MI its no illegal they actually want people to do it, I disagree I get to much glair from some cars that just drop in blue bulbs or blue HIDs'. It depends on the car if the HID will scatter light or not, some pictures on this forum suggest that the DJ does actually place the light of HID well and not all over like some cars do. I would go against installing HIDs into the high beam because HIDs take some time to warm up to their temperature and if you turn the lights on and off and on and off repeatedly it severly decreases the life of the HID bulb and ballast because it needs a boost of power to light the arc that is an HID "burning filament". So if you drive with high beam HIDs at night and drive on a road that has some traffic you might flip them on and then 5 seconds later see a car and have to turn them off, then the cycle continues. Also our Cars use the high beam as DRL and it runs the high beam at what is it 50% power? i can't remember, and running a HID at low power can cause a flicker effect and well in short it kills the bulb quicker also.

I have put philips HIR bulbs, 9012, and 9011, instead of HIDs here is my video of the HIR along with my LEDs in our DJ...

The new HIR bulbs are very good, I don't see the need personally for anything brighter in these anytime soon, and the Brights are just insane on the DJ with these in.

and them recommending 9008 does sound wrong to me also.

Edited February 18, 2013 by burgandy25

[bramfrank]

It is illegal everywhere - the statutes are federal. States can only tighten up on federal statutes, they can't allow them to be bypassed.

[burgandy25]

It is illegal everywhere - the statutes are federal. States can only tighten up on federal statutes, they can't allow them to be bypassed.

I stand corrected, you are right, they are not Legal for street cars and do not conform to DOT NHTSA standards, Do you know if you put an HID into a projector if that would make it officially "legal" as in a complete HID retrofit, the bulb and projector?

I guess it just depends on the state and their enforcement of it, I talked to a State Trooper here in MI and he said they do not ticket those with HIDs in their car unless its blinding or purple in color.

[bramfrank]

Indeed - ANY modification of factory lighting makes one subject to receiving a ticket - you likely can 'get away with it' if it doesn't bother anyone, but that doesn't make it legal. Like I wrote earlier in the thread, if an officer is looking to fill quota you can be tagged for an equipment violation. And if your state does inspections, a modified headlight can cause the vehicle to fail.

Note that states DO have the right to individually regulate auxiliary (add on) lighting - there are different rules as to how many lights, what colors they can be, where they can be mounted and how bright they can be and even when they can be used.

Edited February 18, 2013 by bramfrank

[onecrazyfoo4u]

Legalities aside, I would never spend almost $200 on an HID kit. DDM tuning makes very good kits at only $30-40 per kit. I know many many many people that have used DDM for many years without a single problem. The light output looks the exact same as any other "high class, fancy, overpriced" kit. IMO, you're just throwing your money down the drain.