FWD vs AWD in snow

[dhh3]

I purchased a 2014 DJ Crossroad 2 months ago. I never considered AWD, because as soon as I saw this Copper Pearl beauty, I knew I had to have it. This is my first non 4wd vehicle in over 20 years. I had a Bronco II, Subaru, 2 Ford Explorers, Jeep GC, Jeep Liberty, Dodge Durango (Lemon), Jeep Commander with QD II - wow! (forced to sell it because of my wifes health), and finally a Dodge Nitro that I bought new in 2011. So, now the Dodge Journey. Winter is coming - soon, I think because some of the trees are already turning here in NE Indiana. Will I be OK with FWD or do I need to trade it for an AWD? I realize that I will loose $ doing this, but I only have 1,200 miles on the DJ so far. Any advice will be helpful.

I did read it is better to start in 2nd. Thanks But a search of the internet provided nothing except cars for sale or reviews.

Edited December 5, 2014 by dhh3

[OhareFred]

I have a FWD 09 my first non 4 wheel drive in years. My last was also a Durango. The stock Kumo tires are, in my opinion, absolute garbage. I put a different set of tires on and got through Chicagos last winter ok. Didn't go out in the middle of a storm, but when I did have to go through slush/snow it was ok. Not even close to 4wheel and I did start in 2nd after almost every stop. Now they plow pretty good around here so that helped a lot . Not sure what else to say. If you travel in storms a lot go for the AWD, if it's mainly after, try your luck.

[rolly]

If you have a brain between your ears and understand the road conditions drive accordingly and you'll be fine. I've never had a problem in snow with FWD, if you're concerned invest in some snow tires and you're all set!

[hockey_puck]

I bought the 2wd Limited exactly because I wasn't interested in AWD and it's extra cost, weight and just another thing to service. Instead I spent that money on an extra set of alloy wheels and winter tires. I'm more concerned about turning and stopping rather than going. I look at it this way. If the snow is that deep, I'll just stay home. Been using winter tires for years and you'll never pry them from my cold frozen hands........

[redtomatoman]

I bought the 2wd Limited exactly because I wasn't interested in AWD and it's extra cost, weight and just another thing to service. Instead I spent that money on an extra set of alloy wheels and winter tires. I'm more concerned about turning and stopping rather than going. I look at it this way. If the snow is that deep, I'll just stay home. Been using winter tires for years and you'll never pry them from my cold frozen hands........

Right. From what I have read here, AWD is FWD when the Service AWD light comes on. Seems to happen every time AWD is needed most. Glad I got FWD.

Peace.

[jkeaton]

We went through 4 winters and a bit of snow here and there with our FWD 09. It was a trooper in the snow, even with the factory Kumho's. As stated, if you are that concerned, get some snow tires and understand it is NOT a 4wd vehicle and most likely wont get you through 3' snows. If you drive it like you know what your doing and understand the capabilities, you will be fine.

[YellowDuck]

In Indiana you should definitely be putting on winter tires. AWD / FWD makes no difference to braking, so either way you want tires with good cold weather performance. FWD with proper winter tires is a good setup for all but the worst winter road conditions. You will be fine.

[B4ZINGA]

This is my first AWD vehicle. Previously I've owned four FWD sedans (two Intrepids, Grand Prix, 300M Special that I store now) and one higher performance RWD Charger R/T. Never had issues in my front drivers. Helps that the engine weighs down the front end a bit. My Charger had bald tires last year so I turned off the traction control every time it snowed and used power-slide techniques to get around until I could put on new tires. New Toyo Proxes 4 solved all of my traction problems.

It'll be interesting to see if the AWD in my Journey makes a notable difference, but I'm not expecting it to.

[redtomatoman]

It'll be interesting to see if the AWD in my Journey makes a notable difference, but I'm not expecting it to.

Right. I have FWD and it is fine. I have seen planty on this forum complain that the service AWD light is ever present in snow.

Peace.

[Lobitz68]

Right. I have FWD and it is fine. I have seen planty on this forum complain that the service AWD light is ever present in snow.

Peace.

Your FWD handles all that New Mexico snow pretty well, eh?

The reason people get the light is because they are driving like dim wits... If you nail the skinny pedal and the wheels start spinning at a different rate due to slippage, then the light will come on. If you drive normally and NOT like an idiot, then the AWD works flawlessly... We had quite a bit of snow last year after I bought my DJ and it absolutely handles better than a FWD. Can a FWD get you through the winter? Absolutely, lots of people do it every year....but the AWD does make a noticeable difference if you use it for what it is.

[redtomatoman]

Your FWD handles all that New Mexico snow pretty well, eh?

When you live at 7000 feet elevation in NM, you get some snow. And, yes, my FWD does fine in the snow.

Peace.

[Journeyman425]

No problems last year with stock Kumho's and FWD. Our terrain is flat. Not enough snow here to warrant the purchase of winter tires, but it is sound advice for those who live where the snow is frequent. You'll spend a lot less money on winter tires than on the trade-in difference between your current Crossroad and one with AWD. Keep your car.

[dhh3]

I asked my Service Manager this same question, and did he suggest snow tires if I have issues. Is it OK just to put Snow Tires only on the front, as long as they are the same size?

I am not expecting to have any issues; just looking for suggestions. I have not used snow tires in 40 or so years! I just take it easy in the snow. Thank you for all who replied.

Edited September 26, 2014 by dhh3

[bigtsr]

If your front tires grip better than the rear and you brake

let say on a down slope your rear end may end up doing

complete 360.

Different tire features such as traction capabilities on a

like surfaces can play havoc on AWD vehicles systems.

[dhh3]

Mine is FWD. That is why I was asking if I could put snow tires only on the front, or is it recommended to do all 4?

[Journeyman425]

All four should be replaced regardless of the drive system. Mismatched tread patterns will create more handling problems than they solve.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Journeyman425

[hockey_puck]

Is it OK just to put Snow Tires only on the front, as long as they are the same size?

DON'T DO IT! If money is the issue, then shop around and buy the 4 cheapest you can find or even used. Let me make a strong point. If you buy winter tires to propel yourself through deep snow, then you should really consider AWD. What winter tires do best is help you keep control in corners and stopping power. More so, if you have antilock brakes and traction control. If the snow is so deep, and you hear it rubbing the bottom of the car, nothing will help, if you get hung up. I cannot count the number of times over the years I've stopped quickly on a slippery surface and watched my rear view mirror because someone behind is having a huge problem stopping because of 3 (not 4) season tires. Or last winter when we had a lot of icy ruts, the large number of cars spun out into the ditch and as I drove by I can see by just the tread pattern they do not have winter tires. If you live in a snowbelt, and must travel, then I'd highly recommend them, if not. consider local conditions and avoid driving on those crappy days.

Here is a great article from driving.ca

When it comes time for the winter tire install, some folks are still hesitant about the cost. That’s fair, but don’t try to save by installing just two winter tires. Most shops will refuse anyway since liability, should you be in a collision, can come back and bite them in the behind.

Four winter tires are needed according to Transport Canada and all the major tire companies. It is not about increasing tire sales, it is about the safety of the driver and passengers. By using just two winter tires, the car has different grip capabilities at different ends of the car. It is like trying to play hockey on one hockey skate and one broomball shoe. There would be a whole lot of slipping and sliding going on.

The same is true for your car. Imaging going into a slippery corner with the winter tires only on the front. The front tires will have more grip and track into the corner, but the rears won’t have enough grabbing power to make the corner. In this instance, the car will have a rear skid and spin. This is an oversteer skid. If we enter the same corner with the winter tires on the back, the rear of the car is now in control. Turning the steering wheel asks the front tires to turn the car, but the back tires want to keep going straight. This condition is understeer, and the car will just plow ahead straight until it runs out of road.

Even driving a car with the latest, greatest stability management system does not help. All these electronic systems can do is maximize the traction you have, they cannot create traction. They can move the power or braking force to the tire with the most traction, but if only two tires have good traction the system is severely limited in what it can do to save the skid situation.

If cost is that big of an issue, consider looking for less costly winter tires or have a look at Kijiji or Craigslist for some good used rubber.

[dhh3]

Wow! Awesome response! Thank you very much. I am learning alot, concerning this subject.

[Lobitz68]

Wow! Awesome response! Thank you very much. I am learning alot, concerning this subject.

I've seen some research that says if you do go with only 2 snow tires that it is actually better to put them on the rear... Keeps the rear end from swinging up on you in corners, during hard stops, etc. I would still recommend doing all 4 though.

[dhh3]

With a FWD car, putting snow tires just on the rear seems odd, although I do understand the logic by what you posted. I'll wait until Winter gets here. I may be making a big deal out of nothing!

[Neto]

We bought our Journey in Florida, so it just had original type street tires on it. Last winter we put snow tires on the front, and left the rears. It was fine, and we never had any of the problems people here are talking about. But of course we drive sanely, anyway. (I lived in Minnesota for 4 winters, and drove a RWD car with just normal street itres, and a bit on the bald side. Poor man College days. There were some times when I couldn't get up the hill on the drive way, but I got along fine, by driving carefully.) Last Spring we put on 4 new tires, so we'll need to put the snows back on in a month or so. I was hoping to find some good used steel wheels for sale, so I could keep the snow tires mounted, and just swap them out myself, but haven't found any closeby. What other vehicles share the same wheels, anyway?

[dhh3]

I'm planning on mounting a set of Firestone Destination St tires. From all that I have read, they have excellent traction in the snow, and their wet performance is Best. If these tires were good enough for Dodge when they displayed the new Crossroad across the country, they are good enough for me!

That leaves me with a set of Khumos with about 2,000 miles on them!

[redtomatoman]

I'm planning on mounting a set of Firestone Destination St tires.

They seemed quite difficult to find when I was looking for tires. Never did find a set; even at the firestone store. Hopefully you'll find them.

Peace.

[dhh3]

Not to be. They have been on National Back Order for months. Has something to do with making snow tires. The Destination ST is considered a Summer Performance Tire. Dodge must have paid a pretty penny for the set on the Red Show Crossroad that Dodge showed around the country last summer. I tried to order a set today. No deal; so I settled on a set of Bridgestone Dueler H/L Alenza Plus, P255/50R19, the same size as the Show Firestone Destination St's. Dry Performance: Best. Wet Performance: Best. Winter Performance: Better. Snow Performance: Better. Once it snows, I will let you know how they perform. These tires actually cost $217.51 more than a set of the Destination ST and they have a 15,000 mile greater tread life! Now, my Crossroad should look like it is supposed to look, based on the pictures taken at the Chicago Auto Show and now I know why Dodge is selling the Crossroads with the crap Khumos, instead of the Destination ST.

BTW, these tires are .15" taller on sidewall height, .3" bigger in diameter, and 1.18" wider when compared to stock. Speedometer will read 65.67 @ 65 mph. I can live with this. The wheels on the Red Show Crossroad are the same wheels as my Crossroad. At least something is right!

Pictures to come!

Edited October 20, 2014 by dhh3

[dhh3]

Found an online quote this morning, saving my $94.00 from the price he quoted me at the store.. Since I brought in an online quote for the Destination St's, he said that if I found one for the Duelers, he would honor it. Good news for me. Plus, I received a $60.00 coupon in the mail. So, everything is coming together. I will let you know how they handle the snow.

Edited October 21, 2014 by dhh3