Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Yesterday after driving to the grocery store in my 2014 CVP Journey the push button start would not work. I pulled out the key that is part of the keyless entry and looked in the two place where the key is supposed to be used, under the screen and at the very back of the car but neither place had a key slot. How are we supposed to use the key to start the vehicle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramfrank Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 (edited) So how did you get home? You should have started by reading the manual. In it you'll read that if the fob doesn't work, there is a passive component inside that is detected when you use the plastic end of the fob to push the starter pushbutton . . . . if that doesn't work, then you are calling for roadside assistance. From the manual: Edited February 16, 2015 by bramfrank dhh3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhh3 Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 (edited) I guess that it is time for me to read my manual, too! I just went out and looked. I have never noticed the little slots in the door handles for a key! Edited February 16, 2015 by dhh3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 So how did you get home? You should have started by reading the manual. In it you'll read that if the fob doesn't work, there is a passive component inside that is detected when you use the plastic end of the fob to push the starter pushbutton . . . . if that doesn't work, then you are calling for roadside assistance. From the manual: Yes I did get home. No I could not find the manual and have downloaded a new copy now. The problem was not with the key fob battery since I had two of them in the car and the ignition switch would still not turn over the motor when pushed. Within the key fob is a metal key and two of the power outlets in the car have a key symbol on them. The problem I had was neither had a slot in which to put the key, just the round opening that you use to power a phone or GPS. I tried the front one first and the metal key just got stuck. Luckily I was at a canadian Tire so went in to buy a pair of needle nose plyers and got it out. Then I got out of the car and opened up the rear door and tried to put the key in that. After getting back in the car I called Roadside Assistance and was told there was a three hour wait just to answer the phone call. Since it was -22 outside I tried the push button again and this time the engine started. The dealer is my next stop to find out what I'm supposed to do with the metal key. I guess it may only open the door and I can try the nose of the key fob if it happens again, although with two keys in the car I'm not sure why that would be the issue or why it did start eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhh3 Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Is the push to start button wired to the starter, or wireless? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtsr Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 The key in the fob is only used to open the doors manually and lock the glovebox. If you have the push button start the fob has an IR chip in the end opposite to the key location and although I have not tried it supposedly pushing the start button with that end the chip will be recognized and the start sequence will work. This would only be required if the fob was dead as in battery failure. I did not think the CVP had push button start but used the pre 2011 usb appearing fob/key assembly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhareFred Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Within the key fob is a metal key and two of the power outlets in the car have a key symbol on them. The problem I had was neither had a slot in which to put the key, just the round opening that you use to power a phone or GPS. Seriously? The big round opening that looks like a cigarette lighter? Ok, the reason two have a key symbol on it is because they only work when the ignition is on, or the car is running. The one with the battery symbol is on all the time. Good thing you chose the ignition only one, you would have shorted everything out jamming a little key in there. Read your newly downloaded manual, then drive to the dealer and ream them out for not explaining the car to you when you took delivery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Within the key fob is a metal key and two of the power outlets in the car have a key symbol on them. The problem I had was neither had a slot in which to put the key, just the round opening that you use to power a phone or GPS. Seriously? The big round opening that looks like a cigarette lighter? Ok, the reason two have a key symbol on it is because they only work when the ignition is on, or the car is running. The one with the battery symbol is on all the time. Good thing you chose the ignition only one, you would have shorted everything out jamming a little key in there. Read your newly downloaded manual, then drive to the dealer and ream them out for not explaining the car to you when you took delivery. Thanks that makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 The key in the fob is only used to open the doors manually and lock the glovebox. If you have the push button start the fob has an IR chip in the end opposite to the key location and although I have not tried it supposedly pushing the start button with that end the chip will be recognized and the start sequence will work. This would only be required if the fob was dead as in battery failure. I did not think the CVP had push button start but used the pre 2011 usb appearing fob/key assembly. 2014 CVP definitely has the push button start. This is the first vehicle I've had with this technology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramfrank Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 All Journeys starting with the 2011 model have the keyless entry and start system. It is not for the dealer to explain the entire vehicle, including troubleshooting techniques to the buyer but rather just to show them the highlights. The buyer is directed to read the manual in order to get acquainted with the fine details of how things are operated, what maintenance to perform, what the various values are for such things like tire pressure and what to do when something out of the ordinary happens . . . . you'd think that this would be obvious, especially considering that a vehicle is the most, or second most expensive acquisition of their lives for the vast majority of owners, When I ran the tech support group for a high tech manufacturer the most-often-reported problem was realated to RTFM - Read The F*cking Manual - calls from people too lazy to read their manuals. I could have reduced my call centre staffing by 60 or so people based on that alone - the load dropped significantly when we started taking credit card authorisations at the start of a call and explained that the call would be free of charge if the issue wasn't covered in the manual, but that it would be billable based on time expended if it was. Cisco does that too these days. OhareFred 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtsr Posted February 17, 2015 Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 Tell me about it - I spent 35 yrs working in customer service for high tech equipment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 Thanks for the input on this issue. The basic problem still exists in that if the push button to start the vehicle does not work, it appears the only option is a tow to the nearest dealer. The manual, which I have read, does not address that specific problem unless it is a low battery issue with the key fob but that is not the problem in my case. I'll talk to the dealer when next there or if it happens again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecrazyfoo4u Posted February 17, 2015 Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 Can't believe no one has asked the obvious yet...are you sure you're pushing down on the brake pedal when trying to start? If not, it'll just cycle the car to accessory, then power on, then off with each button push. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 Can't believe no one has asked the obvious yet...are you sure you're pushing down on the brake pedal when trying to start? If not, it'll just cycle the car to accessory, then power on, then off with each button push. I've had this vehicle for 10 months now so do know about pushing on the brake pedal before pushing the start button. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramfrank Posted February 17, 2015 Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) It's not that stupid a question if you take the thought a bit further . . . . if the switch on the brake pedal was intermittent you would not be able to start the car, assuming everything else was working. This is likely the first thing your dealer should have checked if he was on the ball. So when you pressed the button did the accessory circuit come on? Or was the car completely non-responsive? Edited February 18, 2015 by bramfrank rolly 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecrazyfoo4u Posted February 17, 2015 Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 I've had this vehicle for 10 months now so do know about pushing on the brake pedal before pushing the start button. I had to ask the obvious after you said you tried sticking the key in the cigeratte lighter sockets to try to start it. LMFAO!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramfrank Posted February 18, 2015 Report Share Posted February 18, 2015 I had to ask the obvious after you said you tried sticking the key in the cigeratte lighter sockets to try to start it. LMFAO!!! That was truly a great return . . . . . big belly laugh when I read that!! onecrazyfoo4u 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red G8R Posted February 18, 2015 Report Share Posted February 18, 2015 This has happened to me twice, first in my 2014 Journey and then my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee. The fix: rock the steering wheel then push the start again. After the first incident with the Journey and three hours later a tow to the dealer, nothing wrong was found. In fact, with the hook up to the tow truck, it was able to start. I then read on the Jeep forum of a similar problem with a Dodge Ram. He suggested the link between the starter and the steering wheel lock. A few months later it happened to me in my Jeep and I remembered the suggestion of rocking the steering wheel and low and behold it worked. What convinced me it is linked with the steering lock was a third start button fail in my 2008 Audi A4. This time after pushing the button and failing to start, I pushed again and the steering wheel "jumped" (I guess the lock was released) it then started. Something worth trying if it happens to you again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2015 This has happened to me twice, first in my 2014 Journey and then my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee. The fix: rock the steering wheel then push the start again. After the first incident with the Journey and three hours later a tow to the dealer, nothing wrong was found. In fact, with the hook up to the tow truck, it was able to start. I then read on the Jeep forum of a similar problem with a Dodge Ram. He suggested the link between the starter and the steering wheel lock. A few months later it happened to me in my Jeep and I remembered the suggestion of rocking the steering wheel and low and behold it worked. What convinced me it is linked with the steering lock was a third start button fail in my 2008 Audi A4. This time after pushing the button and failing to start, I pushed again and the steering wheel "jumped" (I guess the lock was released) it then started. Something worth trying if it happens to you again. That sounds like it may be the solution. I'll certainly try it before calling out the tow truck if it happens again. Appreciate the input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobitz68 Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 Also, if there is interference with the signal it will not start. Make sure the fob is not in a pocket with a cell phone, metal money clip, etc. This will cause delays in recognizing the key. When it happens to me I just push it a second time and it usually starts right up... there seems to be a brief period you need to wait for the car to recognize that the key is in the vehicle. You can tell it has recognized it because the small display in the gauges comes on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjiv Posted February 25, 2015 Report Share Posted February 25, 2015 After a Tow to the dealer they found a loose wire on the starter. I could hear the clicking but it would not turn over. I only had 864 miles on the beast at that time. I have been trouble free since then. They really are nice vehicles. rolly 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhh3 Posted February 25, 2015 Report Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) Just for clarification on the three power port covers: the ones with the key indicate they only work with the key in the ignition: engine running, but they might work on ACC. The one in the console has a battery. It is on all the time for charging your phone out of sight, or whatever. No one has still answered my question: is the starter button wired to the starter, or does it just send a signal? Just curious. Edited February 25, 2015 by dhh3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramfrank Posted February 25, 2015 Report Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) Consider that it cranks for as long as it takes to start the vehicle, whether you are holding the button or not, so - it just sends a coded signal to the vehicle controller which in turn handles the engine. Edited February 25, 2015 by bramfrank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2015 After a Tow to the dealer they found a loose wire on the starter. I could hear the clicking but it would not turn over. I only had 864 miles on the beast at that time. I have been trouble free since then. They really are nice vehicles. I agree they are nice and functional. pjiv 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Sadgrove Posted February 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2015 Just for clarification on the three power port covers: the ones with the key indicate they only work with the key in the ignition: engine running, but they might work on ACC. The one in the console has a battery. It is on all the time for charging your phone out of sight, or whatever. No one has still answered my question: is the starter button wired to the starter, or does it just send a signal? Just curious. It makes me wonder why they show they key symbol on the two outlet covers rather than the engine symbol to show power is only available when the engine is running? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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