pmjay Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 So, I guess I am in a mess and learning the hard way about engine oil levels. I had my "new to me" 2010 journey to the dealer for an oil change and piece of mind check about 6 months ago. Previous owner was my Dad. About 4 months later, the engine sounded louder to me, maybe a "chugging" sound I thought or sounds kinda like a diesel. It didn't mean anything to me, and I figured I'd get it checked out if it got any worse. I checked the dipstick the other day and there was no oil reading visible? I immediate took it to the garage for and oil change. Guy there said it was making a "knocking" sound and there was likely engine damage. I now know I would have caught this sooner if i had changed the oil sooner, but I'm surprised there was no warning light nor did the oil temp gauge every go over normal. After the oil change, the noise has remained the same. My question is what do I do now?? This vehicle only has 58,000 kms on it, but it is out of warranty. My local mechanic doesn't want to touch it, he says to get a dealer to do a diagnostic. Other than the noise, it seems fine. Is it going to get worse? What to do now? Any useful suggestions appreciated. engine noise.mp4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhh3 Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 I would get a compression check on all cylinders. Your local mechanic should be able to do this for you. This will tell you that the valve seals and piston rings are still good, or not. If the noise that you heard was piston slap. this would indicate that the connection rod bearings are bad, which in turn will cause the piston rings to fail. Could be just one cylinder or all 6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmjay Posted August 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 So are the connection rod bearings the most likely thing to have been damaged but a lack of oil? They then cause the piston rings to fail? I guess this will be somewhere to start. I don't think my local guy is interested. May need to call the dealer...this could get ugly/costly fast. With all the vehicles I've had over the years...this is a first. dhh3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkeaton Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Sorry this happened. I check my oil level every time I fill up with gas. So, after the oil change it was still making the same noise? It must have gone somewhere. Either burning or leaking. It is certainly not normal for that much oil to be used. On a side note, even though there may not be oil on the dipstick, there is still oil in the pan. It's not completely dry. Not saying it was not completely dry. Hard to tell without opening it up. dhh3 and 2late4u 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2late4u Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 dealership will be the most expensive place to have it checked or fixed ,find a good mechanic as you probably will need a used engine from the scrap yard or an aftermarket engine. sorry it happened but i always check my oil at least every two weeks or less. by the time the gages or idiot light tells you anything its to late..only takes less than a few minutes to check your oil , antifreeze levels......muy daughters drives a postal route. and i check her vehicles because she doesn't seem to remember to do it, have caught hers several times being low on oil and antifreeze.... dhh3 and jkeaton 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bramfrank Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 If you want to know whether it was truly dry all you need to do is know how much oil you added to get it to the 'full' line and subtract that from the engine capacity. If there was no 'oil' light the obvious questions are: 1. Why not? Doesn't it come one with the ignition and before the engine starts? Maybe the low oil was simply unelated to the problem and something else caused the noise. 2. What did the garage say about the fact that there was no indication of a low oil condition when he found that the dipstick was dry? You may be able to get 50,000 miles or more out of it even with the noisy engine. It depends on what's actually making the noise. I don't disagree with the sentiment regarding not using a dealer; but the mechanic you choose has to be good AND honest. That combination is less common than it should be. Good luck. dhh3, jkeaton and OhareFred 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhh3 Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 2 hours ago, pmjay said: So are the connection rod bearings the most likely thing to have been damaged but a lack of oil? They then cause the piston rings to fail? I guess this will be somewhere to start. I don't think my local guy is interested. May need to call the dealer...this could get ugly/costly fast. With all the vehicles I've had over the years...this is a first. Possibly. But they are where the connecting rods connect to the crankshaft; thus the lowest part of the engine. I think that they are lubricated by oil lines aimed at them. If they wear, piston slap means that the connecting rods are not rotating in a circular motion which causes the pistons to move back and forth within the cylinder (piston slap). This will put undue pressure on the piston rings. If you heard a noise, this is probably what you heard. If you go to your Dealer, you are going to pay Dealer Labor Costs, which are usually higher than shops. Doing a compression check entails removing a spark plug, and screwing in a pressure gauge which will give you the compression of the cylinder. You have a 2010 R/T which probably means you have the 3.5. To change the plugs in the 3.5, you have to first remove the intake manifold. This is why your mechanic may not want to do this. If your valve seals are still good, and it is determined to be the rod bearings, you may need a short block. Let's hope that you didn't spin a rod bearing. (rotates in the block housing) = new short block. :-( jkeaton 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtomatoman Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 Make sure the oil is full. My opinion, take it to a dealer so you can get a mopar tech diagnosis. The noise could be the exhaust manifold gasket or something unrelated as bram suggests. The lack of engine symptoms says to me that this could be coincidental. If the dealer says you need a new engine, drive it to a mechanic you trust (no harm in driving it if you need a new engine anyway), and have a used engine installed there. Lightly used engines are fairly inexpensive. Best of luck to you. Peace. dhh3 and jkeaton 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmjay Posted August 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2016 I have an appointment with the dealer for a technician to diagnose the engine. I've been checking the oil level to make sure it's not dropping. Wasn't able to get the dipstick out tonight, not sure why? Engine was still hot so maybe I can get it out in the am. I am driving it as little as possible until I get a diagnosis. dhh3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhareFred Posted August 19, 2016 Report Share Posted August 19, 2016 Ok, you say its noisy. I got that. Hows is it running? Hows your mpg? Are you leaking anything? I drove my Bronco with one bad cylinder for two years before I swapped the engine out. Bide your time if all seems well but the noise. My 09 with the 3.5 has been noisy since day one. Maybe it always has been but now you notice it more because you know you were low on oil...... 2late4u and dhh3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2late4u Posted August 19, 2016 Report Share Posted August 19, 2016 just for kicks i check lkq parts and 3.6 with about 51k goes for about $1800. U.S. then you have labor charges and extras.... and as usually you are buying a pig in a poke as you dont really know how great the used engine is compared to a rebuilt or new but is a lot cheaper. dhh3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtomatoman Posted August 19, 2016 Report Share Posted August 19, 2016 1 hour ago, pmjay said: I have an appointment with the dealer for a technician to diagnose the engine. I've been checking the oil level to make sure it's not dropping. Wasn't able to get the dipstick out tonight, not sure why? Engine was still hot so maybe I can get it out in the am. I am driving it as little as possible until I get a diagnosis. Keep us posted. . . Good luck! Peace. dhh3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmjay Posted August 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2016 8 hours ago, OhareFred said: Ok, you say its noisy. I got that. Hows is it running? Hows your mpg? Are you leaking anything? I drove my Bronco with one bad cylinder for two years before I swapped the engine out. Bide your time if all seems well but the noise. My 09 with the 3.5 has been noisy since day one. Maybe it always has been but now you notice it more because you know you were low on oil...... Well, the noise you can hear on the video clip. It's not as loud as it seems on the video, just the camera is right in the hood. That noise has been going on, unchanged for a month,you don't hear it when driving, just at idle and when you first accelerate.. Didn't seem so drastic to uninformed me. Vehicle runs fine, no lights ever came on, no leaks, mpg seems fine, temp gauge normal range. I've probably drove 2000+ kms like this. dhh3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmjay Posted August 31, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 An update: Had the Journey in to the dealer and the top end of the engine (lifters and PCV valve) needed replacement. They said the low oil didn't necessarily have anything to do with it. Sometimes it just happens. BIG SUPRISE was even though I was past the 5 year warranty, my kms were so low, they made a good will offer that Dodge Canada would provide the parts. I just had to pay for labor! $2000 job became $550! Was never so happy to spend 500 bucks!! They did give me a check your oil lecture! rolly and jkeaton 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtomatoman Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Glad you got your DJ fixed. I would echo the "check your oil" sentiment. Peace. rolly 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkeaton Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Glad you got it fixed and had a positive dealer experience! rolly 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srk23 Posted September 14, 2016 Report Share Posted September 14, 2016 So the problem was bad lifters? I've got the same noise but it started at around 90,000km. Currently over 110,000km Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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